Classic Alfa Forums

Excellent skills Kev - deeply impressive......

Me too, interesting to see it slowly getting there. Bit more honest than Car SOS.

Have you got a waiting list kev? My Giulia might need a bit of work when I get to look it over properly!

thing is with the likes of car sos type programs they have masses of folks doing them, the man hours are far more than gets shown on tv, as we know.

was reading a simply superb restoration in a mag last week (can't remember what car) which had taken 4,000 man hours!!

think about it, that equates to 100 40 hour weeks...or just over 2 years for someone doing it full time.

mind you, it was an incredible job




bit more done to the little imp, repaired the inner arch on the drivers side

fitted the outer arch, well mostly. welder broken half way through

arch got lined up as best as I could, swage line at the rear end isn't in the best position but these are hand made arches so can forgive a little discrepancies
rear bottom section needed a big gap filling up so a patch was made up to fit along with filling the gap between the replacement quarter panel and arch panel


inner arch repaired at bottom end too
front section now boxed in
whole section now fully repaired, needs a bit of tidying but all solid metal now instead of fresh air and rust!

off to collect a pair of fibreglass front wings tomorrow, not sure how good they'll be...
if not i'll have to repair the rotten metal ones

Well I hope the wings turned out to be good.

On the car SOS it would make it far more interesting if they did show how many hours went in to it or even just gave it a simple rating or summing up as Kevin does on Grand designs.

In fact any type of substance rather then a childishly transparent deal for parts.

The only interesting deal on that was the very kind chap who gave away the Audi engine for the Quattro. guy.

Making good use of that new welder Kev

the imps' front wings were pretty shot, drivers side one especially so

picked up a pair of fibreglass replacement ones, only new metal ones we could find were £500 each!!!

the bonnet also needs major repairs, not only the front lip which has heavy corrosion but the underside bracing etc is as crumbly as dust.

handily enough a fibreglass one turned up last week on ebay at Lincoln, a bargain for £38. saves hours and hours of metal fab.

bonnet fits a treat, always a worry with FB items..
drivers side wing could then be arranged as I now have something (the bonnet) to line up against!

i'd already chopped off the top portion of wing rail, it was in the wrong place for the FB wing and pretty rotten anyway. an angled repair section with a slight curve to follow the wing shape and a notch or two to get it level was made up
then welded into position
this got me a decent line with the bonnet and a very stable edge to fasten the wing to the top rail
trouble is as i'd already discovered before I started, the shut line to the door is anything but good! i'll have to chop it off and either move it to the right position and fill in the gap or just make another wing edge to graft to the wing itself

the area between the screen scuttle and the bonnet also has some alignment issues, not the bonnets fault I don't think but my own mistake at welding the panel back in the wrong position
I next made up a repair section that will follow the bonnet line much better
it'll go here next time i'm up at the unit, in a much neater position I might add!
most likely won't be there on Saturday, Christmas eve and all. couple days off next week though so may get a full day in...

enough of the xmas pud and mince pies....


the patch I made up last time got trimmed to shape and manoeuvred into a position ready to fit after a bigger hole had been cut out
welded in
fit to bonnet now what I wanted



next job was the gap to the door front edge, the fibreglass wing was just terrible!

options were to chop the edge off the wing and move it or just make a new edge....

a folded section was readied, the short edge needed manipulating so the outer facing edge would follow the contours of the door. a piece of card cut to shape is used for a guide as to what shape you need to end up at
a bit of shrinking and we are there
the swage lines at the top were more tricky, much tighter turns but some patience at it's near enough
I can now set the gap exactly where I want it

Top workmanship as always chap

this solved the alignment issues at the door edge but the fit around the headlight section was just terrible. realistically there was a shed load of work needed to get it anywhere acceptable, probably the only solution would be to use the front off the original steel wing.

faced with such silly ideas I decided that i'd go down another silly route, repair the original steel one1 at least the fit around the headlight would be spot on and I already had a new door edge made up....

i'd originally thought against repairing it as so much needed doing, the whole arch lip plus the door edge and most of the top section.....


once i'd got a few points fixed in a repeatable place so I could take the wing off and get it back on in the same place I cut off the grot from the top..
i'd already made up a repair section for it, quite a tricky one as the folds weren't uniform gathering in towards the front plus having some curvature too
lined up to meet the previous repairs to the scuttle and follow the swage lines which will link in with the door gap section
welded into position
i'll keep adding sections as I go, will be a bit of a patchwork quilt when it's done but better than £500 for a new one!!

Top work Kev!
Seasons greetings to you and your family.

cheers guys, last update of 2016

a few hours on the drivers wing this afternoon...

started off fixing the repair section for the door edge with a few tack welds before more permanent welds in front and behind it
repair section now in place, wing still loosely in position
the wing rail needed an extension piece main to join the wing itself to the cars wing rail, this got spot welded to the wing which will itself then be spot welded to the car
the underside then got a clean up and some etch primer liberally sprayed into the seam to keep moisture from doing damage, seam sealer will also go in before fitting to the car where I can. you can also see that the arch edge has quite a bit of reconstructing still to do....
should eventually sit about here, a tweak or two to get full alignment and a section doing for the sill join but we're getting there
about it for now, Wednesday should see a return to normal after all the xmas upheavals, be nice to get somewhere close to thinking about paint prep....



thanks for all the kind comments guys, on this thread and through texts etc. really does help to keep the ball rolling with your support. one day rob will have a car to be proud of, I hope

Your threads are a joy to follow and I suspect an inspiration to many of us. I have to use a 'bit' of filler here and there to get my repair sections to look right and I make them in sections to get the curves right. Perhaps I should invest in a sheet metal folder and try a bit harder to reach your standard of workmanship.
How do you prevent heat distortion ? Thats always been my main problem.

My only problem with following this thread is that I have started to look too hard at the adverts for Imps in Practical Classic's !

Mind you it is the same price as looking at the Intergrale thread unless I come into foolish amounts of money.

Keep going, its great to see a job well done and as many must think its a shame you don't live just down the road.

lol, cheers for the commenst again guys, great to know it's well received

heat distortion from welding is a big issue crank, only way to minimise it is to take heaps of time. give the weld enough time to cool before doing the next tack. i'd love to do a full seam weld in one pass but it'd look like the north sea by the time you get to the end! something like that arch repair section can easily take 45min to weld on just because of doing a few tacks well away from each other then forcing yourself to walk away for a few mins, then making sure it's cooled before doing another series of small tacks.

I have heard of a paste that can be applied to the surrounding panel that soaks up heat but I've not tried it

the metal folder is a very useful tool, great for crisp edges quickly. a pair of pieces of angle iron clamped in the vice works ok too but it's easy to hammer the metal over in the wrong place when making a fold, this stretches it and causes a curved edge.
if you do fold metal over in angle iron sections like that then don't hammer it at the edge, hammer at the fold line to stop the edge being stretched which causes the curve.

I picked up loads of little tips on the course I went on, was a lot of money but I do think it's improved my panel making no end, even if it did give me a jolt at my limitations compared to the amazing work by the course lecturer

a shrinker/stretcher is one of the best tools I've bought lately too, amazing at making curved panels. i'll be making an arch section for the wing for the imp...from a straight folded section, can go into a bit more detail on the process when I do it if anyone is interested?

I have some of that heat absorbing paste from 'FROSTS' and it certainly gets hot, but its not enough to prevent distortion. I am just too impatient and must learn to slow down.
I am certainly interested in learning more of your techniques as I am sure are others. Getting good even curves is certainly the key to making good repair sections. At the moment I just rely on hammering one side of the panel and that works quite well, but having a fold complicates matters and I usually cut a few V,s into the smaller fold to let the panel bend. If you see what I mean.

thta's the stuff, i'll get myself some.

deifnetly taking your time is the biggest influence on distortion, it's great to do lovely long runs with the welder but the worst thing to do for the panel. small tacks that you eventually link together is the way to do it.

I too used to put slots in folds to create the curves, only since being shown on the training course that I've discovered how best to do it.

i'll take a few pix and show some tips

another trip up to the unit to carry on with the imps' wing rescue

the previously made repair sections which got etch primed to seal some zinc in are now covered over with seam sealer, that should stop any moisture getting between the joint. once we're done a good dose of waxoyl should complete the job.

the lower edge of the front panel, which i'd not really looked at before, also seems to need a bit of work.
I did think about doing that first but decided that getting the wing on as a guide to where the panel would need repairing to made more sense

so a few spot welds and seam welds where possible and it's in position
the mounting rail needs a good lip on it as in the imp this is your luggage space, rainwater getting in isn't the best!
i'll start making up the arch lip inner and outer sections on Saturday, may have been easier to do it with the wing off but at least now it's solid enough to work off

some jobs done last Saturday afternoon but not posted, the underside of the front panel got chopped about a bit and repaired with a nice thick section
the outer skin I chopped away in readiness
i'd also bought some more angled sections to make an arch repair section, I could cut a piece off a sheet of course but my folder won't take a long enough section to do it in one piece

some stretching action and it's about the shape needed
should sit about here...
has a little twist in it to follow the wings contours

Looking good

today I made a start on the rest of the front panel.

first job to make and fit an outer repair section
the underside of the passenger side then got chopped out so I could straighten out the big dent it had around the indicator opening, was pretty well stoved in but has come out pretty well
another underside plate made up and fitted along with the other half of the outer skin
underside back to being strong enough for the suspension to stay where it should be!

bought myself another new tool to help with the panel making, had been toying with getting one for some time but the arch repair section meant I really did need one

the face of the repair piece needed to be folded over to create the lip of the arch, being curved meant that folding it all by hand would be tricky to say the least!

a bead roller was called for
as you wind it through the tool following your marked line very carefully it creates the fold where you need it.
ending up with a nice crisp fold
which when put against the car you can see what i'm trying to achieve....which throws everything out of kilter again so needs more work on the shrinker
bit more tweaking and it's getting close
near to the shape i'm after

pretty much got the shape I need
bit of etch on the front panel, inside and out so it runs out and that'll do for the day

Bloody 'ell Kev, you can make anything
I am so impressed with how you just take everything in your stride.

don't know about in my stride mate, just got a rough idea of how to achieve it so have a go, what's the worst I can do?

am feeling like i'm getting better at it though, but still a way to go before getting anywhere near your guys standard of work, but then again I can't spend the time needed to make everything spot on. happy with the compromise i'm getting.




plus I've got a firm deadline to work to now....33 turning up in march for paint, the imp needs to be done, painted and back on it's wheels before the 20th march

Very impressed with the arch .Looks spot on to me . Very handy new tool you got there. Who's 33 are you doing?

Johnboy wrote:Very impressed with the arch .Looks spot on to me . Very handy new tool you got there. Who's 33 are you doing?

my old 33, now belonging to my mate paul, who is contemplating a run to Italy in it with his trip to the GP
so getting it painted in good time kind of puts a rush on it

Are that one . Yeah, no pressure